What is a high quality camcorder for video??

Q. Hi there!

I would REALLY love to be able to make videos to put on the computer and edit. But, I don't have the video camera to do that with. What's a good one?

I need one that's got awesome quality video and audio. And of course, I need it to be able to plug in to my computer and transfer the videos. Also, if I were making a short movie, does this camera come with a microphone for enhanced sound quality? If not, do you know of one I could look into?

Thanks alot.

A. If you have the money, you will want to get a professional camcorder that can handle XDCAM or DVCPRO HD quality. Any of the other professional video cameras the record to basic HDV are also good and can be found as low as $1,000 new or even cheaper for older used models.

If you can not afford any professional models, there is a huge myriad of consumer level camcorders that can work for you as well. It all comes down to what your specific filming needs are.

All of the professional camcorders come with very good microphones. If you get a consumer model, you can add professional audio by adding a Beachtek device and an appropriate microphone.

Your Windows computer will come Windows Movie Maker for free, but it may not be able to handle HD video. Macs come with iLife which includes iMovie and iDVD. With a Mac computer, you will be able to handle HD video and burn DVDs right out of the box. The Windows system will probably require more work to find all the appropriate software for your needs.

There are a number of medium and high grade editing programs which will definitely do much better work. Sony Vegas Pro, Avid's Pinnacle Studio, and Final Cut Pro Express are all available for less than $100. You can also get something more powerful like Thomson Grass Valley EDIUS, Adobe Premier Pro CS3, or Final Cut Studio 2, but these will cost hundreds of dollars or more.

Original Question

Are all the Canon Vixia camcorders the same video quality with only differences in zoom and battery life?

Q. I wouldnt mind getting the lowest price model if video quality can be the same with only differences in battery life and such. I'm just going to make a skateboard videow itht his so the angles and stuff I want don't require such high tech super focusing power or something. I can deal with the low battery life also just want to make sure the video quality is the same.

A. No.

The HG series were designed to record very highly compressed AVCHD/MTS format video to an internal hard drive. The HF and HF S series were designed to record very highly compressed AVCHD/MTS format video to flah memory. Some have built-in flash memory, some use removable SD cards. The MTS files are copied to the computer over USB and the video editor must decompress them before editing. The video editor must be capable of dealing with MTS files - or you need to convert the files first - typically, if you convert the MTS files to some other format before your editor gets them, this means the video is no longer high definition. There is no clearly defined long-term archive process flow in case you want the video in a year, or 2 or 5 or 10...

The HV series were designed to record to miniDV tape using the same DV and HDV format used by professional videographers. The DV and HDV video formats are recorded to inexpensive miniDV tape - but this means your computer must have a firewire port to import that video... and it also means that when you do not re-use the tape, it is the long-term archive. Most video editors can deal with DV format video - HDV may be a problem (but most likely just with the low-end editors like MovieMaker). Assuming it is not a problem, after inporting the video and editing, you can export that high definition video project back to the camcorder and use the camcorder as a playback deck and watch in high definition oin a HDTV when the camcorder is connected with component or HDMI cables. This is not possible with flash memory or hard disc drive consumer camcorders.

If your computer has no firewire port and no way to add one, then you only decent option is flash memory. Even though the video file types and video compression are the same, hard disc drive camcorders have other known issues with vibration and high altitude - and potential video data recovery challenges when the camcorder breaks and the video has not yet been transferred. With miniDV tape or flash memory, just take the tape or memory card out and find a similar camcorder for transfer. In the case of a flash memory card, just use a cheap card reader.

There's lots more, but these are the big-deal issues.

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What brand and model(s) camcorder can be used to get this same exact quality video?

Q. Video link: http://vimeo.com/60241860

A. The best Quality Video Camcorder in the Consumer Level Camcorder Market, is a MiniDV tape Camcorder. HD Camcorders, that being any Camcorder storing the Video it shoots to anything but tape, and DSLR cameras, all interpolate the Video. What that means, as the take video and store it on the storage media, they take one frame from the lens, several from the internal electronics within the Camcorder, one frame from the lens, several from the internal electronics within the Camcorder, one frame from the lens, several from the internal electronics within the Camcorder, and so on until the end of your Video.

Looks like this, where lens frames are + and camera made frames are >

+>>>>>>+>>>>>>>+>>>>>>>+>>>>>>+>>>>>>> and so on

The frames made by the HD camcorder internal electronics, not from the lens, are 80% of any HD Camcorder's videos. They are all made using an algorithm based on the frame from the lens before and after these frames. Mostly impossible to edit

Furthermore, you can get a MiniDV tape Camcorder for under $600, to even try to get a HD camcorder that could shoot as good or better Quality Video, you would need to spend $5400 to find one that could.

Original Question

Best affordable camcorder for video quality?

Q. I have spent hours searching for the camcorder that would best suit my needs. I am looking for a camcorder that is less than $800; has built-in memory (at least 40-60 GB); can take pictures; has a good battery life; and most importantly, has a good video quality. Any help from you guys? Thank you!

A. If you require best available video quality, you won't get hard disc drive or flash memory (od DVD) - miniDV tape is still king.

There is no consumer camcorder that comes with a battery with "good battery life) in the box. You will need to get an optional high capacity battery (from the camcorder manufacturer).

All consumer camcorders, at the price point you specified, can take stills. Camcorders were not designed to take stills - the take video well; but stills not so well.

The Canon HV30 meets your requirements - with the exception of the HDD.

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What type of camcorder can i use to recorded in good video quality?

Q. ok so i have a band named All But The Fallen! and so i wanted to recored a type of music video for a song that we wrote but i have had lots of diffent camcorders but the video quality is bad and sometimes you cant understand what were saying and so i i decide tp ask here and thanks

A. Your recording a band, just pointing a camcorder at yourselves will not produce a very good video. What you need to do is find out if any of those camcorder have a MIC jack. If so hook something like this up - http://asimplelife.ca/boss.html, run the feed out to the MIC jack on that camcorder. Then get several friends to man the other camcorders and make your self a good video. The camcorder with the audio feed going into it is your audio track, all the video from all the other camcorders is bonus. Have fun doing a multi camera edit.

Using what you see on my site, I have recorded audio from one band, many renditions of that band, many different members of that band, many times. I simple run wires from the system they have, which is capturing the microphones and electric guitars, and run 3 microphones to the drummer and record sometimes with a camcorder, but due to location and atmosphere where I record this, it is easier to use a Digital Audio Recorder to capture the audio.

Have Fun.

Original Question

How good is the video quality of the Canon Powershot SX10 IS?

Q. Should I just buy a digital camera AND a camcorder? Or is the video quality of the SX10 good enough to replace a camcorder? What gigabyte of SDHC card would be appropriate for shooting videos?

A. Not any P&S camera can match the quality found on the most modest camcorder and certainly none of the features found on camcorders.

The video feature on P&S cameras are just a little marketing feature, never meant to replace a true video camera

If your goal is to make video shorts of other homegrown videos, look to camcorders made by Canon, Panasonic, JVC or Sony

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What do these camcorder video quality selections mean?

Q. I recently bought a JVC Everio camcorder and there are different selections in the video quality category. They are "LS/LE/SSW/SEW/SS/SE". I don't understand what these different selections mean. So if someone could give me a break down of what each individual quality type means, that'd be great :)

A. That little booklet, white with a generic picture of a camcorder in the same series as yours, says"Basic User's Guide" on it...is not just extra packing material.

Likely (you did not give your particular model number) it will explain all this, look on page 13, more on 25, and technical descriptions on page 30.

In practical use, set to the highest resolution/lowest compression and leave it alone. If you are sure the final product will only be used on DVD, you will get a little more recording time by lowering your resolution from the HD formats down to the best Standard def format (SSW).

Original Question

Why is my video quality so horrible on the computer compared to the camera? (Read Description)?

Q. I have a Panasonic HDC-SD9 Camcorder. The video quality is bright and awesome on the camera, but when I upload it to my computer, it's dark and poor quality. I have to go through the memory card because it won't let me simply plug the camera into the computer when uploading videos, could that be the problem?

A. Lights, lights, lighting is key. Learn how to adjust exposure. Does your computer have better than the following specifications, if not, do not expect to be able to play or edit that footage.

Minimum System Requirements*

Windows® 7, Windows Vista® (SP2), or Windows XP (SP3)
Intel® Pentium® or AMD Athlon™ 1.8 GHz (2.4 GHz or higher recommended)
-Intel Core™ 2 Duo 2.4 GHz required for AVCHD*
-Intel Core™ 2 Quad 2.66 GHz or Intel Core i7 required for
AVCHD* 1920
1 GB system memory recommended, 2 GB required for AVCHD*
DirectX® 9 or 10 compatible graphics card with 64 MB (128 MB or higher recommended)
-256 MB required for HD and AVCHD*
DirectX 9 (or higher) compatible sound card
3.8 GB of disk space
DVD-ROM drive to install software

Windows® 7, Windows Vista® (SP2), or Windows XP (SP3)
Intel® Pentium® or AMD Athlon™ 1.8 GHz (2.4 GHz or higher recommended)
-Intel Core™ 2 Duo 2.4 GHz required for AVCHD*
-Intel Core™ 2 Quad 2.66 GHz or Intel Core i7 required for
AVCHD* 1920
1 GB system memory recommended, 2 GB required for AVCHD*
DirectX® 9 or 10 compatible graphics card with 64 MB (128 MB or higher recommended)
-256 MB required for HD and AVCHD*
DirectX 9 (or higher) compatible sound card
3.8 GB of disk space
DVD-ROM drive to install software

* Requires free product activation via the Internet

Original Question

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How good is the video quality of the Canon Powershot SX10 IS?

Q. Should I just buy a digital camera AND a camcorder? Or is the video quality of the SX10 good enough to replace a camcorder? What gigabyte of SDHC card would be appropriate for shooting videos?

A. Not any P&S camera can match the quality found on the most modest camcorder and certainly none of the features found on camcorders.

The video feature on P&S cameras are just a little marketing feature, never meant to replace a true video camera

If your goal is to make video shorts of other homegrown videos, look to camcorders made by Canon, Panasonic, JVC or Sony

Original Question

Are all the Canon Vixia camcorders the same video quality with only differences in zoom and battery life?

Q. I wouldnt mind getting the lowest price model if video quality can be the same with only differences in battery life and such. I'm just going to make a skateboard videow itht his so the angles and stuff I want don't require such high tech super focusing power or something. I can deal with the low battery life also just want to make sure the video quality is the same.

A. No.

The HG series were designed to record very highly compressed AVCHD/MTS format video to an internal hard drive. The HF and HF S series were designed to record very highly compressed AVCHD/MTS format video to flah memory. Some have built-in flash memory, some use removable SD cards. The MTS files are copied to the computer over USB and the video editor must decompress them before editing. The video editor must be capable of dealing with MTS files - or you need to convert the files first - typically, if you convert the MTS files to some other format before your editor gets them, this means the video is no longer high definition. There is no clearly defined long-term archive process flow in case you want the video in a year, or 2 or 5 or 10...

The HV series were designed to record to miniDV tape using the same DV and HDV format used by professional videographers. The DV and HDV video formats are recorded to inexpensive miniDV tape - but this means your computer must have a firewire port to import that video... and it also means that when you do not re-use the tape, it is the long-term archive. Most video editors can deal with DV format video - HDV may be a problem (but most likely just with the low-end editors like MovieMaker). Assuming it is not a problem, after inporting the video and editing, you can export that high definition video project back to the camcorder and use the camcorder as a playback deck and watch in high definition oin a HDTV when the camcorder is connected with component or HDMI cables. This is not possible with flash memory or hard disc drive consumer camcorders.

If your computer has no firewire port and no way to add one, then you only decent option is flash memory. Even though the video file types and video compression are the same, hard disc drive camcorders have other known issues with vibration and high altitude - and potential video data recovery challenges when the camcorder breaks and the video has not yet been transferred. With miniDV tape or flash memory, just take the tape or memory card out and find a similar camcorder for transfer. In the case of a flash memory card, just use a cheap card reader.

There's lots more, but these are the big-deal issues.

Original Question

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What type of camcorder can i use to recorded in good video quality?

Q. ok so i have a band named All But The Fallen! and so i wanted to recored a type of music video for a song that we wrote but i have had lots of diffent camcorders but the video quality is bad and sometimes you cant understand what were saying and so i i decide tp ask here and thanks

A. Your recording a band, just pointing a camcorder at yourselves will not produce a very good video. What you need to do is find out if any of those camcorder have a MIC jack. If so hook something like this up - http://asimplelife.ca/boss.html, run the feed out to the MIC jack on that camcorder. Then get several friends to man the other camcorders and make your self a good video. The camcorder with the audio feed going into it is your audio track, all the video from all the other camcorders is bonus. Have fun doing a multi camera edit.

Using what you see on my site, I have recorded audio from one band, many renditions of that band, many different members of that band, many times. I simple run wires from the system they have, which is capturing the microphones and electric guitars, and run 3 microphones to the drummer and record sometimes with a camcorder, but due to location and atmosphere where I record this, it is easier to use a Digital Audio Recorder to capture the audio.

Have Fun.

Original Question

How good is the video quality of the Canon Powershot SX10 IS?

Q. Should I just buy a digital camera AND a camcorder? Or is the video quality of the SX10 good enough to replace a camcorder? What gigabyte of SDHC card would be appropriate for shooting videos?

A. Not any P&S camera can match the quality found on the most modest camcorder and certainly none of the features found on camcorders.

The video feature on P&S cameras are just a little marketing feature, never meant to replace a true video camera

If your goal is to make video shorts of other homegrown videos, look to camcorders made by Canon, Panasonic, JVC or Sony

Original Question

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I read that Mini-DV camcorders produces the best video quality, which latest camcorder will you recommend?

Q. Another question, will Sony HDR-SR11 camcorder (planning to get one) gives me the video quality that the Mini-DV can give?

A. MiniDV is just the media format. It doesn't necessarily give the best quality.

Better to say that the best quality in semi-pro camcorders and down use MiniDV.

However, the Sony HDR-SR11 is phenomenal. It can out perform many HDV camcorders (those use MiniDV just in HD format...highest quality you'll get for MiniDV).

You might want to consider Sony HDR-SR12, since that's the same camcorder, but the hard drive is larger...60 GB is big, but better to be safe =P

But yes, that Sony HDR-SR11 is one of the few camcorders that will replace MiniDV.

Original Question

Is there really a huge difference in video quality between analog and digital camcorders?

Q. How much better is the video quality of a new digital camcorder compared to the older analog or Hi8 tape camcorders such as the Sony HandyCam. I am particularly curious about the zoom. Many of the newer camcorders have 60X or lower zoom levels, my Sony HandyCam has a 64X zoom and still has reasonably good quality at that level.

A. The intended use of the video will also determine your apparent quality differences. If you have a small CRT television that you play back on and do no further editing, then there may not be much apparent advantage to a new digital camcorder, MiniDv or HD (H.264). If you edit and show your videos to a wider audience, or have a 720i or better TV, especially one of the larger ones, then yes, you will see a huge improvement in quality, even with the inferior HD format (Which is a marketing gimmick that is a step back from MiniDv).

One area in which analog MAY be superior, is in poorly lighted scenes. With advanced editing software such as Avid, more detail can be obtained from apparent darkness on analog than on digital. But if you have a $20,000 editing station, your not likely using a HandyCam!

Original Question

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Are all the Canon Vixia camcorders the same video quality with only differences in zoom and battery life?

Q. I wouldnt mind getting the lowest price model if video quality can be the same with only differences in battery life and such. I'm just going to make a skateboard videow itht his so the angles and stuff I want don't require such high tech super focusing power or something. I can deal with the low battery life also just want to make sure the video quality is the same.

A. No.

The HG series were designed to record very highly compressed AVCHD/MTS format video to an internal hard drive. The HF and HF S series were designed to record very highly compressed AVCHD/MTS format video to flah memory. Some have built-in flash memory, some use removable SD cards. The MTS files are copied to the computer over USB and the video editor must decompress them before editing. The video editor must be capable of dealing with MTS files - or you need to convert the files first - typically, if you convert the MTS files to some other format before your editor gets them, this means the video is no longer high definition. There is no clearly defined long-term archive process flow in case you want the video in a year, or 2 or 5 or 10...

The HV series were designed to record to miniDV tape using the same DV and HDV format used by professional videographers. The DV and HDV video formats are recorded to inexpensive miniDV tape - but this means your computer must have a firewire port to import that video... and it also means that when you do not re-use the tape, it is the long-term archive. Most video editors can deal with DV format video - HDV may be a problem (but most likely just with the low-end editors like MovieMaker). Assuming it is not a problem, after inporting the video and editing, you can export that high definition video project back to the camcorder and use the camcorder as a playback deck and watch in high definition oin a HDTV when the camcorder is connected with component or HDMI cables. This is not possible with flash memory or hard disc drive consumer camcorders.

If your computer has no firewire port and no way to add one, then you only decent option is flash memory. Even though the video file types and video compression are the same, hard disc drive camcorders have other known issues with vibration and high altitude - and potential video data recovery challenges when the camcorder breaks and the video has not yet been transferred. With miniDV tape or flash memory, just take the tape or memory card out and find a similar camcorder for transfer. In the case of a flash memory card, just use a cheap card reader.

There's lots more, but these are the big-deal issues.

Original Question

I read that Mini-DV camcorders produces the best video quality, which latest camcorder will you recommend?

Q. Another question, will Sony HDR-SR11 camcorder (planning to get one) gives me the video quality that the Mini-DV can give?

A. MiniDV is just the media format. It doesn't necessarily give the best quality.

Better to say that the best quality in semi-pro camcorders and down use MiniDV.

However, the Sony HDR-SR11 is phenomenal. It can out perform many HDV camcorders (those use MiniDV just in HD format...highest quality you'll get for MiniDV).

You might want to consider Sony HDR-SR12, since that's the same camcorder, but the hard drive is larger...60 GB is big, but better to be safe =P

But yes, that Sony HDR-SR11 is one of the few camcorders that will replace MiniDV.

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how do i get better video quality using a dazzle dvd recorder?

Q. When i record something with my film camcorder, i transfer it to my computer by playing it back and recording it onto my computer using the dazzle dvd recorder. When i do this however, the video quality drops significantly, but the audio is fine. how do i get better video quality with my dazzle, even though my camcorder doesnt have an s-video output?

A. You did not tell us which camcorder.

If it is an analog camcorder, you are reducing the quality when you transfer to the VOB DVD standard definition format. Each time you compress, you reduce quality. When you compress the video, dideo data is discarded. When you "decompress" the video, the decompression is providing only "best guess" when rebuilding the video.

If you want "best video quality", then don't re-use the tapes - transfer directly from the camcorder to the computer and skip the offload to the DVD recorder.

I don't think you are using a "film" camcorder. Film cameras would require you to send the exposed film out for developing and return to you with the developed film. Analog and digital video tape are more likely what you are using.

If you are using analog tape (VHS, VHS-C, Hi8), then get an analog/digital converter (USB for Pinnacle Dazzle; firewire for Canopus ADVC55 or ADVC110).

If you are using digital tape (Digital8 or miniDV), then install a firewire port on your computer and transfer the digital video directly. Firewire, IEEE1394 and i.LINK are all the same thing. If your computer has no firewire port and no expansion slot to add one, then your only option is the USB-connectinganalog/digital converter described above. USB-to-Firewire adapter/hub/converter/cable things do not work.

In either case, bypassing the DVD step you currently do and saving that for the LAST step of the process will greatly improve your video quality.

Original Question

If you want to upload videos to the computer easily, what is the best camcorder to have?

Q. Is it better to get a DV camcorder, even though it requires a firewire port? Is it better to get a hard drive or sd card camcorder? I don't want a flash memory camcorder, but most importantly I want a camcorder with good video quality on the camera and the computer once it is transferred.

A. The best video quality continues to come from video captured in DV or HDV format. For consumer camcorders, that means miniDV tape. There are external hard drives for camcorders typically with a firewire port - from companies like Focus Enhancements (FireStore) - but even those external hard drives save to DV or HDV format.

Internal hard drive or flash memory based camcorders typically store the captured video in a very compressed MPEG2 (standard definition) or AVCHD (high definition) format.

DVD camcorders compress even more into their VOB or VRO format files and their video is not menat to be edited - though people try by ripping the video, the quality is not very good.

Video compression = discarded data = reduced video quality.

Firewire400 ports are typically cheap to add
http://shop2.frys.com/search?search_type=regular&sqxts=1&query_string=firewire+card&cat=&submit.x=0&submit.y=0
if your computer has an available PCI port.

If you use an Apple Macintosh, they have had firewire ports for almost ten years... the only exception is the new Mac Air.

From my experience:

MiniDV tape: Lock the tape, then rewind to where you want to start the import, click import, go do something else until the import is done. The clips are a single huge file in the editor, but making the individual clips is as easy as dragging them to the desktop outside the editor window. Store the tape in a cool dry place, nice long shelf life. Camera dies, get another camera. Do not reuse tapes.

Hard drive or flash memory: Since all the files are individual (and there will be more than you expect because the largest file is 20 minutes - there is no frame drop, but there is an extra step to put the clips back together when editing), and copying to your computer is fast - some computer operating systems may need an additional file conversion step. Before you start editing, make another copy of the files for archiving... another hard drive or burning discs (data DVDs, not video DVD format). Camera dies - let's hope all the files were transferred, otherwise, the internal HDD is not removable, so get to know folks like http://drivesavers.com/ and open your wallet REALLY wide...

Original Question

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how do i get better video quality using a dazzle dvd recorder?

Q. When i record something with my film camcorder, i transfer it to my computer by playing it back and recording it onto my computer using the dazzle dvd recorder. When i do this however, the video quality drops significantly, but the audio is fine. how do i get better video quality with my dazzle, even though my camcorder doesnt have an s-video output?

A. You did not tell us which camcorder.

If it is an analog camcorder, you are reducing the quality when you transfer to the VOB DVD standard definition format. Each time you compress, you reduce quality. When you compress the video, dideo data is discarded. When you "decompress" the video, the decompression is providing only "best guess" when rebuilding the video.

If you want "best video quality", then don't re-use the tapes - transfer directly from the camcorder to the computer and skip the offload to the DVD recorder.

I don't think you are using a "film" camcorder. Film cameras would require you to send the exposed film out for developing and return to you with the developed film. Analog and digital video tape are more likely what you are using.

If you are using analog tape (VHS, VHS-C, Hi8), then get an analog/digital converter (USB for Pinnacle Dazzle; firewire for Canopus ADVC55 or ADVC110).

If you are using digital tape (Digital8 or miniDV), then install a firewire port on your computer and transfer the digital video directly. Firewire, IEEE1394 and i.LINK are all the same thing. If your computer has no firewire port and no expansion slot to add one, then your only option is the USB-connectinganalog/digital converter described above. USB-to-Firewire adapter/hub/converter/cable things do not work.

In either case, bypassing the DVD step you currently do and saving that for the LAST step of the process will greatly improve your video quality.

Original Question

If you want to upload videos to the computer easily, what is the best camcorder to have?

Q. Is it better to get a DV camcorder, even though it requires a firewire port? Is it better to get a hard drive or sd card camcorder? I don't want a flash memory camcorder, but most importantly I want a camcorder with good video quality on the camera and the computer once it is transferred.

A. The best video quality continues to come from video captured in DV or HDV format. For consumer camcorders, that means miniDV tape. There are external hard drives for camcorders typically with a firewire port - from companies like Focus Enhancements (FireStore) - but even those external hard drives save to DV or HDV format.

Internal hard drive or flash memory based camcorders typically store the captured video in a very compressed MPEG2 (standard definition) or AVCHD (high definition) format.

DVD camcorders compress even more into their VOB or VRO format files and their video is not menat to be edited - though people try by ripping the video, the quality is not very good.

Video compression = discarded data = reduced video quality.

Firewire400 ports are typically cheap to add
http://shop2.frys.com/search?search_type=regular&sqxts=1&query_string=firewire+card&cat=&submit.x=0&submit.y=0
if your computer has an available PCI port.

If you use an Apple Macintosh, they have had firewire ports for almost ten years... the only exception is the new Mac Air.

From my experience:

MiniDV tape: Lock the tape, then rewind to where you want to start the import, click import, go do something else until the import is done. The clips are a single huge file in the editor, but making the individual clips is as easy as dragging them to the desktop outside the editor window. Store the tape in a cool dry place, nice long shelf life. Camera dies, get another camera. Do not reuse tapes.

Hard drive or flash memory: Since all the files are individual (and there will be more than you expect because the largest file is 20 minutes - there is no frame drop, but there is an extra step to put the clips back together when editing), and copying to your computer is fast - some computer operating systems may need an additional file conversion step. Before you start editing, make another copy of the files for archiving... another hard drive or burning discs (data DVDs, not video DVD format). Camera dies - let's hope all the files were transferred, otherwise, the internal HDD is not removable, so get to know folks like http://drivesavers.com/ and open your wallet REALLY wide...

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